Author	Topic:   More PeTA2
Equinely Yours	posted 10/9/02 8:49 PM     It looks like they aren't too interested in real debate. How surprising is that!?! LOL I guess we'll have to stir things up a bit again. http://www.animalwelfarecouncil.org
Alexie	posted 10/12/02 6:00 AM       What do expect? You don't want them to actually have THINK and questions some of petas crap now do you:)
O. T.	posted 10/12/02 4:33 PM     For those of you that get aroung this country some, what's your guess as to the amount of youngsters that take part in this silliness like peta2, and the adults involved in the craziness of their parent organization,peta? From where I'm from, I've never seen them. I've heard it said that the leaders of any type of antis don't ever want to reach their "goal" of putting anybody out of business, as it would put their anti group out of business also, and they're smarter than that. That sounds reasonable to me. Any input?
TIM	posted 10/12/02 5:55 PM     In response to a question by Kelli in the closed peta2 thread of ... " I was just wondering, what lies does peta tell? " peta claims that for every animal killed by a hunter, it is estimated that at least 2 others are wounded, go unrecovered by hunters, and die a slow painful death. But if such were true, then in the year 2000, in the state of Pennsylvania, the number of deer that would have had to die from either a hunter's arrow or bullet to make peta's statement true would have had to exceed the total deer population of the state.
Junk Yard Dog	posted 10/12/02 6:29 PM     O.T. Where I'm at, local PETA activity seems almost nonexistent. I think the amount of media exposure they get far outweighs the actual impact they have on public opinion. Except for isolated cases, where they concentrate their all their national resource on a specific local event, I think they are mostly ignored by the public. A good example is their "Jesus" stunt a local church pig roast. But, with that said, I think we are dealing with a new breed of "anti" here that encompasses the entire eco-activism genre. I probably have a more sinister view of PETA than some of you. It seems that there is a loose coalition, and cross-over in membership, among all the various eco-activist groups. This alliance is becoming more organized all the time, and the different groups are assuming specific roles. PETA has assumed the role as PR front-man for this alliance and keeps the media preoccupied by prancing nude activist around in public and promoting stupid "got beer" campaigns. This diverts attention away from the activities of the militant groups (ELF, ALF, SHAC, etc) where the real damage is being done. The ultimate goal of this alliance is total elimination of any "adverse human activity" on the earth (which many of them view as a living organism in its own right). Their ultimate goal cannot be fulfilled without destroying human civilization as we know it and eradicating the "human cancer" from the planet. The hardcore PETA leadership will not draw any distinctions between vertebrates, invertebrates, protozoa, etc. They all have "equal rights" to live without interference from mankind. Think of it - to accomplish this, we must abandon activities such as cultivation, mining, building roads, purifying water - not to mention animal research and factory farming. These are only stepping stones along the path to "salvation" of the earth. In their view, the human species will evolve to coexists as an "equal" inhabitant in this new world, or be expunged from the planet.
O. T.	posted 10/12/02 8:18 PM     Thanks for the reply, Junk Yard Dog. That's pretty much what I'm beginning to believe.They are as great a threat as the terrorists we're fighting now.They need to be dealt with, as well. While I'm at it, if any of the peta 2 bunch is still lurking, when you mention protesting the war, what kind of solution do you have in mind? What if we just let it go, and you get injured by a suicide bomb, along with your favorite dog (or rat)or what if your gay boyfriend got killed? Right in your own neighborhood.What then? You better believe it's coming our way if we don't take care of them now.Ever thought of that?
Alexie	posted 10/12/02 10:14 PM       Did any of you read the thread where they are talking about medications they are on? I have never seen so many people on psych meds in one small group in my life. And I doubt all of them posted that they are on meds. What does that say? Also check out the Phobias thread. I see a lot of lonely city kids and adults with who seem to have a problem with human socalization skills. They latch on to animals because animals are non-judgemental. They latch onto the AR agenda to feel apart of something important. They don't want to hear anything that might make their pretend perfect ARA world come crumbling down to where they will have to face reality and people. I think it's sad how peta uses these people to lie to and make money. But they are the ones who need to peel the blinders off and see peta for the human hateing, terrorist funding, liars that they are. I wonder how many of these peta monions know that peta wants to see all domestic animals extinct? How can someone who calls themself an animals lover go along with that??
O. T.	posted 10/12/02 10:43 PM     Alexie,have I seen a photo of you in sitting in a haystack?
mc	posted 10/12/02 10:55 PM     O.T. They have no solutions all they can do is gripe and whine untill something happens to them then OMG we have to have the GOVERNMENT fix it. mc
Alexie	posted 10/13/02 3:02 AM       O.T. Yes, that's me doing my best Hee Haw imitation. Gawd, I need to get Frankie to change that picture to a more normal one. How hard did you laugh?
vulpes	posted 10/13/02 3:57 AM     " I was just wondering, what lies does peta tell? " I have more- just take a look at what they say about trapping for fur,its nearly all lies or exagerations. The one thats the stupidest is the 1 in 4 animals chewing its foot off to escape.I have seen the garbage about nontargets,the 3 out of 4 trapped animals is nontarget- what rubbish! Anytime you see anything about orphaning of baby animals by trappers,that is 100% bovine doodies.I have seen the peta posters with the baby fox on it that says " I miss my mother,is she on your back?". What Peta won't tell you is that fur in spring is rather shedding and matted,so even if an area has a year round fox season,no one is going to trap fox in spring for the fur. What will happen if fur trapping is banned ,will be a dramatic rise in nuisance control trapping/animal removal.Alot of animal problems are in spring-coons in attics,foxes snatching chickens to feed their young,ect.In these cases,due to rabies concerns,any female raccoon or fox captured must be euthanized by these specially lisc people. Wouldn't it be far better to take them in winter for fur,that to waste them and starve the young in spring like that? Thinning the excess animals out sometime before the birthing time= less problems to be dealt with later.Plus the fur is not going to waste in winter time.
O. T.	posted 10/13/02 3:59 AM     Matter of fact, I didn't laugh. I do recall a sound coming out of my mouth, something like "OooLaLa, that HeeHaw girl could make an ol' dog break his chain." Don't worry, I'm harmless, but I might add, you did cause me to have to get my bifocals on. O T is short for "Old Timer."
Alexie	posted 10/13/02 4:11 AM       O.T. LMAO! Thanks! You made my day:)
O. T.	posted 10/13/02 2:32 PM     You're right, mc. Ever noticed how some "know-it-alls" will mention how they hate the way women are treated in Afghanistan,and then cuss "W" and his war on terrorism? They should go talk to the people over there, except for the bad guys, and see what their feelings are about W fighting terrorism. For the "know-it-alls" that love to protest, why don't they go over to Iraq and or somewhere and protest the real bad guys? Now that would be good watching. I would like for them to explain why they don't do that. This has kinda gotten off the subject, but I've seen ARAs cuss the war as well as anybody like us that don't see things their way. And then they call us mindless?
mc	posted 10/13/02 2:46 PM     Mindless blind followers is what PeTA preys on and caters to, as can be seen so clearly at the PeTA2 board follow the party line or out.
O. T.	posted 10/13/02 3:38 PM     Vulpes,you're making sense. I've never been a trapper, and don't intend to become one,but reading what you have to say is making me realize a few things. It comes through loud and clear that peta is once again ranting and raving without facts. I'm not saying I've been listening to peta, all I know about it is what you've written. I've been friends with a few trappers, but it never never was my cup of tea. We never talked about it much. I like the "100% Bovine Doodies" comment. Never had heard that one.
Beaglemutts	posted 10/13/02 6:34 PM     OT <> OT - I think there has been quite a decline in the amount of activists protesting at local protests. About 10 years ago, it was very easy to get 50 or more activists out to a fur protest, however, now you are lucky to get 10. You also see less and less of them. peta used to rely on local groups to do their protests but now they have to travel around more and more in order to get just a few activists to back them. I think the majority of the younguns spend their time sitting behind a computer. The oldsters write letters. If you look at the number of activists at the D.C. March for Animals, you can see the drastic drop in numbers. The first one was quite huge, the second was a total disgrace to the movement. As far as ALF/ELF goes, the age group varies. The little property damage attacks are usually done by the babies in the movement. The more thought out large animal releases are done by those who have been in the movement for some time. There is a lot at risk in those releases and most old timers in the movement aren't willing to risk their freedom on younguns who have a tendency to have "lose lips".
Beaglemutts	posted 10/13/02 6:37 PM     BTW - OT - nothing wrong with being an Old Timer - It's the Old Farts you have to worry about. :)
O. T.	posted 10/13/02 7:41 PM     The number of protestors are dwindling, and yet the $$$$ taken in is growing? Makes me wonder how much of those millions are a part of some little ol' widow ladies pension. They send it in thinking they're doing the right thing, helping animals. I suppose they are helping cats. Fat Cats, that is, the ones at the top of the anti movement. That's a shame.Quite a racket, I'd say.
Beaglemutts	posted 10/14/02 0:38 AM     Yes, the majority of the $$$ comes from little ole ladies. Their mailouts are all targeted to draw in that kind of person. Despite what people believe, celebraties give very little money. They usually will give their time or lend their name instead of donating money. peta also brings in quite a bit of money when they 'table' concerts. The selling of peta merchandise is a big money maker.
O. T.	posted 10/14/02 1:55 AM     The more I learn, the more they remind me of Jim and Tammy Faye Baker. Same game, different approach. Send money,it'll make you feel gooood.
Beaglemutts	posted 10/14/02 5:58 AM     LOL - good analogy.
O. T.	posted 10/16/02 1:49 AM     I got some great replies to my last question, so I'm hoping you guys are still around. I've got another one. I'm from a rural area and have only seen a few punk rocker lookin kids at the mall and around town very rarely. After seeing some of the peta 2 profiles, I got to wondering how many of that type are actually out there. Some of those kids on peta 2 look like ordinary kids, but there are also some that look like they are a cross between a parrot and a clown. I watch all kinds of sports, from all over the nation, and it always seems to be a crowd that a person could fit right in with. Never seems to be anything out of the ordinary. What percent of people in the US are the "go anywhere and fit right in" type, and how many think it's halloween 365 days a year? .
Varmit	posted 10/16/02 3:33 AM     What I find amazing over there is their stand against racial discrimination, prejudice and oppression. They are all against it, yet they want to get rid of rodeo for one example, that many African Americans, Native Americans, etc. have enriched and better their lives because of the sport of rodeo. Most likely known of them have seen any rodeos, so they do not know this fact. Hypocrite? Is that the word that comes to mind?
Gene	posted 10/16/02 5:34 PM     While they're generally more urban than rural, punk, Goth, hardcore kids are everywhere, and I'm glad. If there's anything I can't stomach, it's complacent, ordinary people living in a shrink-wrap world. If a contemporary, urban suburban kid doesn't have a hearty dose of defiance, I figure he's too dumb to know better and deserves whatever he gets. (Agricultural kids are an entirely other matter; their responsibility and focus inspire me because they connect to the real deal.) But I know plenty of punks and usually consider them more on the ball than their button-down classmates willing to slurp up whatever BS "product" they're spoon-fed by the masses. PeTA is the problem, not punkers. I applaud the kids for searching for their own way in the world. It's just a tragedy that they're vulnerable to PeTA's twisted, hateful agenda.
O. T.	posted 10/16/02 9:01 PM     Thanks, Gene, I suppose we are all guilty of being too judgmental at times, and maybe that could be the case with me. By looking at them, and never knowing one personally, I guess I never associated them with having brains. Just couldn't get past the shock of seeing them. There are three girls that I've been wondering about for awhile, now, because last winter I had to spend some time on crutches, and one day I went to the mall. The mall doors here are not automatic and are big, heavy doors. There were two girls going in at the time who were painted up and dyed up and all the five senses had jewelery hanging from them,but one jogged ahead and held the door open for me while the other went ahead and opened the second entrance door. I thanked them and they were as sweet as they could be. I purchased whatever it was that I was there for, and on the way out there was a group of them near the exit, and another girl ran ahead of me and held both doors for me. She was as sweet as the others. I thought at the time if she lost her lip, eyebrew, nose , ten or twenty ear rings, and got rid of the purple hair, I would have only have thought of her as being kind, sweet, kid. Most of the ones I've seen are boys and they are loud, rude, like to throw the "f" word around in public (loudly), so maybe that's why I'm leary of them.
Gene	posted 10/17/02 6:55 PM     Clean-cut jocks throw the "f" word around, too, O.T. You're too accustomed being around cowboys, who usually don't swear, at least in public. While there's been a skinhead, neo-Nazi element in punk from its beginning, and they're still around, they're a mostly shunned splinter group. Most punks, goths, etc. aren't Nazi at all; they're usually sweet girls with purple hair & nose rings opening doors for gimpy old cowboys busted up from riding broncs & bulls. Another surprising thing is that I usually find punk rock musicians the most musically open-minded people around, at least the songwriters. I've spent hours with punk songwriters grooving to Sinatra, Ella Fitsgerald, and George Jones. That's more than I can say for the classic rock crowd, who hate everyone who came after Lynrd Skynrd.
Gene	posted 10/17/02 9:09 PM     Here's a story right up your alley, O.T. Though they didn't invent punk, the Sex Pistols are credited with bringing punk to mainstream America around 1978. Their album was taking off in the states and promoters expected them to play big clubs and halls along the East & West coasts when they arrived from London. But instead, in true punk style, the Sex Pistols dismissed "playing to the choir" in urban rock clubs and chose instead to tour America playing cowboy bars. They toured in a bus all over Texas, Oklahoma, Arizona, etc. playing in the roughest, toughest cowboy bars and chicken wire clubs in the West. They were cheered, attacked, and beaten up everywhere they performed.
Gene	posted 10/18/02 5:25 AM     I forgot to mention, the Sex Pistols spit on their audiences, threw beer bottles at them, and taunted them to fight. That was true Punk! The real deal.

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